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Author Topic: Faster then light travel.
Scooby
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posted 11-30-2000 07:10 PM     Profile for Scooby   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
The other day I recalled reading a few months back about how some scientists successfully accelerated a particle of light past the speed of light. As a result of this, the particle appeared at it's destination before it had even left.

This got me to thinking, what actually happened there. I'm not talking about how they did it, but how it was in two places at once. So here's my idea. It wasn't really in two places at once. No where in nature (to my knowledge) does this occure naturally (hah, aren't I redundant ), so our eyes, and minds even aren't built to register something traveling faster then light, or something like that.

Now any light being emitted from it must travel slower then it. So it would appear to reach it's destination before it had left, because the light from where it had started was still in the process of reaching our eyes, and registering in our brains after it had arrived, and when it arrived, that to had to register in our eyes and brains, so it appeared to be in two places at once, but in reality it actually wasn't.

This is kind of hard to prove though. Any instruments that we have to observe still rely on the laws of physics, and as such cannot observe faster then light. So again, the light from the start would still be registering after it had arrived at it's destination.

For a moment I had thought about touch. Would a blind-person be able to tell? After a little bit of pondering, I think the answer is no. Our senses, and brain even, still rely on the laws of physics. Information in our body is transfered through neurons. These neurons transfer the information via electric signals or something (not 100% sure). While this is amazingly fast, it's still not faster, or even as fast as light, so no, it would not register.

It's impossible to prove though, but the best analogy I can think of is in cartoons, when someone bolts off and a dust cloud is left in the charactor's image. It looks like the char. is there, but the char. has actually left.

--

Just a thought I had


Posts: 2802 | From: Michigan | Registered: Jul 1999  |  IP: Logged
Redlemons
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posted 11-30-2000 08:52 PM     Profile for Redlemons   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
So, how about those Mets?

Needless to say, this shit goes way over my head.


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Scooby
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posted 11-30-2000 08:54 PM     Profile for Scooby   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
LOL!
That's okay, I'm not sure what I'm talking about 90% of the time either

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DeskJet
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posted 12-01-2000 12:17 AM     Profile for DeskJet   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
could you repeat that?
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KRUSTYY
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posted 12-01-2000 01:22 AM     Profile for KRUSTYY   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
You have a point , there. Of which I cannot speak upon though. Science can make us believe anything they wish, as long as the establishment go's along with it. I'm really curious to black holes, and curvatures of space and time.Wormholes and time travel.
Wish this were possible.

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grumpy
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posted 12-01-2000 04:35 AM     Profile for grumpy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
no this is actually some yummy stuff here
uhmm, this was out last spring i think. this news. the throw like a particle of light inta this gas. and this gas kinda like acclerates it aright. okay wutever, here's the good stuff.
if we take this idea, we can now move it towards electrons and stuff or transfering information. right, you see wut i mean.
kidna like, for our stuff to move from one stpot toanother, its like, you have to move it max speed speeda lite er wutever right, and right now, peeps are jus trying to decrease the distance that shit has to travel to make stuff faster, that's you know why, everything is getting smaller, like stuff on watches and shit. anyways, lets say, now we can accelerate it and stuff.
anyways, that's wut this sorta tech is good for
boring my bad

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Snag
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posted 12-01-2000 06:09 AM     Profile for Snag   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
One thing you have to remember is it WAS NOT in two places at once. Just that by all means of instrumentation we have to measure, chances are nothing could track it that quickly. It is like the optical illusion of full motion video of film strips. It is not true motion, just our brain is too slow and is fooled into perceiving it as full motion video.

Now, my question is, they accelerated a particle of light?! I thought that light has not truely been classified as a particle or energy since it exhibits properties of both...either way, light faster than the speed of light??

Another thing is warp fields...bending space to bring too points closer together to make travel that much faster...think of this: If the Enterprise enters warp, it folds space one way, if a Romulan Warbird goes into warp it folds space another way...with ships going everywhere folding space, whouldn't the Star Trek universe be nothing than similar to a piece of oragami

[This message has been edited by Snag (edited 12-01-2000).]


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AcidWarp
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posted 12-01-2000 12:11 PM     Profile for AcidWarp   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
LOL@Snag

Actually, you could probably tell by touch because all that remains of the particle at it's starting point is basically nothing more than an after image. Kind of like when some one takes a picture of you using the flash on the camera, and you get an after image of the flash of light in your eyes. Remember, the particle still has moved, physically it's not at the starting point. I would think that while our eyes can't register the change right away, because physicall it has moved, we coul feel it.

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Oicu812
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posted 12-01-2000 03:20 PM     Profile for Oicu812   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Not sure that this would work either, because the electical impulses in your body are measured in feet per second.

O


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TheKiller
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posted 12-01-2000 04:54 PM     Profile for TheKiller   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
O ~ I calculated mine... 18.5 m/s = 56.25 fp/s

I wonder how close I am from the actual...

Anyways, I believe that the particle can be properly measured.

Think of this. Measure the particle from a relatively far distance so that all of the information being received is constant. Lets say you observe the particle moving from 100 meters away, the relative change in the distance as it moves perpendictular to you is very small probably less that .1 meter. Think of an isocelese triangle as you move the 3rd point farther and farther from the first 2 the distance to center of the line connecting them is prettywell constant and becomes a constant as your distance away from the two points approaches infinity.

A picture would explain it well if you don't understand it

------------------
...TheKiller



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Redlemons
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posted 12-02-2000 03:42 AM     Profile for Redlemons   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
quote:
O ~ I calculated mine... 18.5 m/s = 56.25 fp/s

18ms? You're an LBP. 56fps? Gotta be a GeForce2

A teacher at my school thinks he can build a time machine with the equipment in the science storeroom.


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AcidWarp
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posted 12-02-2000 12:03 PM     Profile for AcidWarp   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I still think that we could feel the diference O, because the objects mass has moved, it's not at the starting point, it only appears to be still there.

The only other thing I can think of is that maybe it was a different particle at the second point. Perhaps all that really happened was that a second particle that was in synch with the first particle appeared. What was true for one was true for the other. Maybe all that was observed was the fact that for every particle of matter or what not, there is another particle that is a twin for it.
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[This message has been edited by AcidWarp (edited 12-02-2000).]


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Scooby
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posted 12-02-2000 12:25 PM     Profile for Scooby   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
You lost me
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Cyborg6
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posted 12-02-2000 03:23 PM     Profile for Cyborg6   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Scoob~ Why didn't you just save some lines of text and say:

quote:
It is like the optical illusion...

...or sumthin'

[This message has been edited by Cyborg6 (edited 12-02-2000).]


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Snag
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posted 12-02-2000 05:59 PM     Profile for Snag   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Just think of the possibilities though...of anything in the future. Can you imagine stars being nothing but a long streak in emptiness as you zip past it? Or how about jumping back in time...which in my mind would be the biggest mind job of all time. And in the "theory" and "ethics" of the time travel premise, you are not to do anything to alter the time line. Just your very presence can do that. I mean, say some chick is totally smitten with you (in the past) and now she doesn't go out with that dude over there who was actually your great great great grandfather who was gonna eventually spawn the dude.....well you get the idea, your time machine is no longer created. now does that make you not exist? does that make you stuck in the past? or does that make it so that you were never there in the first place cause there was no time machine? But then if that happens where there was no time machine, then this chick wouldn't be smitten with you and you would still go to the past...i mean, temperal physics...thank GOD i don't have to think that shit for a living. here is another one: Say that you go to the past, and knock up this chick not knowing who she is. Go back to the future. And whoa!! YOU ARE YOUR OWN FATHER!!! WHOAH!! hahaha Man i have a phucked up mind...
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AcidWarp
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posted 12-02-2000 11:26 PM     Profile for AcidWarp   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Sort of like in Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. Zaphod Beeblebrox's father is Zaphod Beeblebrox the fourth, and his grandfather is Zaphod the third. . . but the current beeblebrox is the first. How'd that happen you ask, well it was an accident with a time machine and a contraceptive.

oh and Snag, it's temporal not temperal

[This message has been edited by AcidWarp (edited 12-02-2000).]


Posts: 4363 | From: Waterloo, Ontario | Registered: Nov 1999  |  IP: Logged
Scooby
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posted 12-03-2000 03:00 AM     Profile for Scooby   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
There is a major problem with time travel that many people overlook: The Universe doesn't stay in one place.

If you were to travel back in time, even one day, you'd be out in space when you arrive, because the earth wouldn't be where it was, due to the orbit of the earth, the movement of the solarsystem throughout the galaxy, and even the movement of the galaxy. It's a very big oversight

Cy~ Becuase I rarely post long things and I wanted a long post(TM)


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Snag
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posted 12-03-2000 03:19 AM     Profile for Snag   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Good call scooby /me tosses out a scooby snack for that one.

BTW, I think you mean the earth doesn't stay in the same place.


and AW, who gives a shit I got my message across lol

[This message has been edited by Snag (edited 12-03-2000).]


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Scooby
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posted 12-03-2000 01:15 PM     Profile for Scooby   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Either would work.
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AcidWarp
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posted 12-03-2000 05:36 PM     Profile for AcidWarp   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
LOL!!@Snag

Actually guys, the universe does move, because it's expanding. Therfore your both right, the Earth wouldn't be in the same place because of it's orbit and rotation, and it would closer (if you went backwards in time) to the center of the Universe. Althought the variation could probably be very small, you may end up missing your mark by only a few feet, or less. Might be a good idea to aim for an open field, traveling back to a major city could cause some interesting problems, I mean, who wants to end up inside the wall of a building.


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